RE: RE: starship-design: YES, we might do it.

[Zenon Kulpa <zkulpa@zmit1.ippt.gov.pl>]

> From: "Walker, Chris" <Chris.Walker@BSKYB.COM>
> 
> > From: Zenon Kulpa [SMTP:zkulpa@zmit1.ippt.gov.pl]
> > 
> >"Impossible" not in the technical sense, but in the economic-social sense.
> 
> OK - my misunderstanding! Although I must admit I'm being pedantic when I
> rule out the word "impossible" - I prefer to use that if something really
> cannot be done (physically). A better term would be "unfeasible", 
> due to the expense, etc.
> 
Granted, I should have been more precise.


> >Unless some "intermediate industry", like space tourism,
> >will pave some of the way, making the required investment smaller.
> >Thou, I am not so sure - we have already tried other intermediate
> >space industries - commsats, GPS - with rather little impact 
> >on serious space exploration (except contributing significantly
> >to the growth of space debris around Earth and outraging Earth-based
> >astronomers and radio-astronomers...).
> >
> Yes, agreed - the problem with things like commsats is that they tend to
> generate money for industries that aren't really space-related, such as the
> satellite TV and mobile phone companies. A company puts up a commsat, and
> the revenue generated by its use is simply used to expand the comms network
> (for example), not to mention lining the pockets of the company directors,
> etc. 
>
Am I right sensing certain hostility to private industry 
as expressed in your texts? I think them being private
and lining the pockets of their directors is not the issue here.
The issue is if their operation in space does forward building
interplanetary space infrastructure than can in turn facilitate
human settling of the system and possibly make us capable of building
a starship if we will seem it reasonable.
The pockets of their directors are not especially important here,
or rather, a possibility to line appropriately these pockets
is a necessary requirement for the industry to be able to exist
at all... 


> It's just not channeled into space exploration at all, as it's an
> Earth-bound commercial interest completely separate from the area of
> interstellar travel. 
> 
Yes, that was my point, roughly - that the rather Earth-bound
"space" indusries, like commsats & the like, and possibly
space tourism too, may have little impact on building a space
infrastructure needed for eventual starship building
(but see the clarification below). 


> In this vein - why should space tourism necessarily provide some of the
> investment for our space infrastructure? A space tourism company will plough
> its revenue back into whatever serves *its* interests, which may or may not
> be what *we're* interested in. I guess the only way in which that might
> happen is if space tourism grows to such an extent that the company decides
> that it is cheaper to mine asteroids for the materials to build its lunar
> hotels than to ship these materials up from Earth. Even if it does this
> though, would it allow anyone else to use its facilities? Again, wouldn't it
> simply plough it resources back into serving its own commercial interests,
> rather than our interstellar exploration ones? Et voila - space tourism, but
> perhaps no investment that we can make use of.
> 
Some clarification seems necessary.

Namely, I do not postulate to build space infrastructure
just for the reason of preparing to build a starship.
I simply say that building a starship will not be possible
without prior building of such the infrastructure.

The infrastructure will be build for quite other purposes,
the main of which is to allow humans settling the system,
in space colonies and/or on other planets & moons.
Thus, I do not expect or demand from space tourism companies
to build starship shipyards, but only to put enough people 
and structure in space so that starting space mines & industry
becomes cost effective, for them and for prospective miners.
Then it will be no question of *using* these industrial facilities
by "anyone else", but the question of paying in cash for their 
products, which I think the owners will be quite eager to accept. 
That can start the construction of the infrastructure,
provided the tourism companies can & will "grow to such an extent".

-- Zenon